Ten63 unveiled! Residents seek to connect with their future community.

When I saw the headline, for a second I thought that Ten63 coffeehouse was re-opening…

So much for the theory that the new building don’t foster a sense of community. Just becasue you don’t sit out on your stoop and greet people passing doesn’t mean that the spirit has died.

you know #4, there are lots of ways to form a community, and online communities are just as valid as any other.

Looks nice, but what I don’t understand is why more developers don’t spend just a little more and try to incorporate existing old buildings or at least their facades into the new building. LIC has a lot of character – both on the residential side and industrial. It would be great if some of that character wasn’t torn down without thought.

Good point. It’s much more expensive and takes a lot more time to incorporate an existing building. I would imagine that would be reflected in the cost of the apts also. I think Arris Lofts has had so many problems because the new was mixing with the original… and it can be very difficult.

#4, as you may note, a number of people here (reading this board) are going to live in the building. The intention is not to create some online world and never leave but it gives us a way to get to get together considering that the building is still under construction and no one can actually live in it yet.

The people in the group are quite friendly and everyone is very interested in becoming a part of the community. We do look forward to getting out and mingling as soon as we move in. Which we are a eagerly awaiting!

I don’t live in LIC yet but make an effort to get out at least every other weekend. I look forward to joining the community.

I personally like this building. I was not happy when hackett came down but I think that it was more sentimental than anything else. Plus, it was not the nicest building around in the first place. I would like to see developers keeping the old when possible bu at least for a new building this one is more than just glass.

14, what do you mean “despite what most people say, I think it’s a great community”? I can’t see how you are referring to anyone in LIC. Nearly everyone I know thinks it IS a great communit.

13, the hideous cinder blocks on the Hackett Building hid a quite beautitful ground floor. Though I liked the HB better, the new building is quite attractive and seems to complement the industrial look of old LIC and scale of surrounding buildings.

Sorry #15, I was not implying that LIC is not a nice community. Just that some people on other boards have constantly bicker about the new vs. the old and a lack of community. I was not saying that I share that view, in fact, I was saying the opposite.
I think that LIC is a great community and I am happy to be a part of it.

I probably shouldn’t have used the word “most” when referring to other people. I probably should have said “despite the ignorant few…”

sorry for any confusion, jsut want to set the record straight.

I think the developer did a great job with this building. The facade surface is not one large flat wall but a series of buttress like columns. The use of the brick with large windows and triangle shape of the building give it a lot of presence.

Nice to hear from our new neighbors.

im a ten63 owner as well—27 yo actor–i doubt it but are there any other artists in this building?! ive been in NYC for almost 5 yrs now and have been in LIC for almost 4. i miss ten63 coffee but absolutely love what theyve done–not a building with the most personality–but amen to bringing brick back–beautiful. im looking forward to beautiful nights on that roof..

Hey Matt,
Have you joined the Google Group?

http://groups.google.com/group/ten63

Not sure about everyone’s profession but you can certainly find out and meet people once you join.

You’ll just be asked a few questions to register.

#9 is right – the two building that did it in LIC were Arris and to a limited extent Powerhouse. It hugely expensive and in the case of Arris is not always successful. I hear there are a number of problem with building systems there and both were s far behind schedule it was ridiculous. As counter-intuitive as it may sound its cheaper to rip down and start over.

this is such a great blog.

being a resident at Arris Lofts, i want to clarify that certain people have issues in the building but not everyone. This building shares the same problems that any new building has. It’s quality of life is great in LIC and you can ask any Arris Lofts owner and they will tell you how happy they are with the building. Many of the post that you’ve read are so negative and exaggerated.

Liqcity.com is always the best place for news! I’ve been on Streeteasy.com for months hoping to get some info about Ten63… and nada.

I’m a future resident and very exciting about moving to my first home. From the looks of the construction, though, I thought closings wouldn’t be until June 2009. I know the developer said Jan/Feb, but there are other buildings in LIC that started before Ten63 and still have not had people move in. Plus, from what I’ve read in other blogs, new construction always has major delays especially as the projected closing date nears. Any thoughts from my new neighbors-in-waiting?

Arris is kind of a lemon, underneath the body of a Porsche. I love the look of the building inside and out, but #32 is correct. There are some very serious issues still, and I’d also agree with earlier commenters that a lot of it has to do with the conversion of an old building instead of knocking down and starting over. I would still hope that these days preservation and conversion will reign over knock-downs (which it’s not) but if they’re going to do it, they must do it well. And not cut corners. Which is what Arris unfortunately did, and now they are paying the price.

Ten63 looks great. I will grudgingly admit. I was not happy when they tore the building down and kicked out that great cafe and stole the name… but the building actually looks like one of the better ones.

In re: preserving parts of older buildings. Other cities – notably DC and Boston preserve the old by shoring the existing facade, demolishing the interior and then building behind and up. It’s obviously not as easy and cheap as tearing the building down completely. The next best thing is to design the new building in a way that truly reflects the old. Ten63 looks a bit more in that direction in the photo but I don’t get that sense at all up close. Powerhouse is a sick joke in this regard.

I personally don’t feel comfortable that we as a community are forced to allow the primary concern of developers to be build it fast, build it cheap, and get outta town with the money.

#35, the alternative is build nothing and have these crumbling monuments to a bygone era. No one like losing some of the old character, but unless it make sense economically no one is going to undertake this type of conversion on their own dime.

37, I’m not sure that’s true. This type of argument is used all the time i.e. “do it this way or else”. Better design mixed with preservation is done in other major Cities and other places here. Building intelligently with an eye toward quality design does more for the intrinsic value of the neighborhood and therefore the developed property than simply building big and being left with over hyped and over-valued garbage.

I’m waiting for people here to get that there is an exact parallel between the real estate market mentality and the corporate mentality that led to the current fiscal meltdown. The two industries have in fact gone hand and hand all the way.

If the properties and buildings were not financed by fragile pyramid schemes that artificially inflated their value, it would not at all be hard to make money building higher quality affordable homes without forcing maximum density.

Isn’t this thread supposed to be about Ten63? Enough about Arris, I want to hear more about Ten63… anyone know what the retail space might be used for? Also, when are tenants expected to move in?

I might be responsible for this converstaion taking a turn off topic. For that I’m sorry, but it’s not about being catty, its about not misleading people. Honestly I’ve looked at most of these new buildings. None stand out in my mind in one way or another, so I don’t care about which is best, but come on! If a member of your family were looking to buy at your building would you in good conscious recomend it? Don’t answer here, but think about that honestly. There is a lot of chest pounding about this building. Negative things have been said on this blog about just about every building and it never get the same reaction. Because of everything that is going on there people feel the need to justify their purchase as a good one. I can understand that.

Anyway, let’s get back to 10-63! Will there be retail on the lower floor? If so any insights at to what it could be?

10-63 looks great, this coming from a very happy arris owner. i think the progress in lic has come along nicely, wish it was quicker, as sure we all do. some great things happening on the water, on jackson, near court sq and near qb plaza. it is all good, something for everyone. nice to have the 7 train on 23rd being refurbished. going to connect with the e/v/g underground, with escalators, that is huge. everyday when i go to and from manhattan, i am in awe of how close and how many options we really have. even take the n frfom time to time to get to central park, so so easy! anyway, how it is a smooth move and on time, delays suck, no matter what building you move to.

a side note, my sis stayed at the verve hotel over turkey dy, $109 a night and they gfave her a couple days of free parking. she was very impressed and go to fao schwartz in 10 min on friday morning. lic is where it is at for nyc value…we are all very lucky.

I second that. please note another bank or cell hone dealer. I would def. find myslef using a specialty food store though.

I’ve lived in the area for a while and this is one of the few buildings that I can say is a nice addition. I just hope that the retail adds some value to the area. I would hate to see another bank move in. I also hope that it fits with the building. It would be a shame to see some bland retail occupy the ground floor of it.

#48 we have so many great wine shops already. Do you not know about them? Vine Wine, Hunters Point Wine, Court Square wine… that one on the waterfront too, what’s it called? Blue steak?

specialty store would be great. housewares would be even greater. I long for a hardware store all the time.

A Housewares store with the emphasis on decor with some light hardware like “Surprise” in Manhattan which has survived through the years in spite of Home Depot & Ikea! We do not need another wine shop – 1063 residents should definitely shop at Vine Wine. Talitha, the owner, was the owner of the much missed 1063 cafe from whence the building got its name!
some other thoughts – a Cheese Shop, a good independent Card and Gift Store, a Crafts & Knitting supply store.
We already have Duane Reade- we do not need another one so close by.

To 40. I can easily flip this around and say show me the numbers that make this all so hard. These buildings have huge returns. Why do you think everyone and his cousin jumped into the development business in the first place? I hope you don’t think it was to altruistically improve the neighborhood or selflessly create opportunities for fledgling buyers?

To 52. I used the term pyramid scheme perhaps too loosely. I assumed that people would know that I was referencing the junk mortgage market and all its related financial vehicles.

My main point may sound harsh. I feel that when brokers and developers are whining about how hard it is to make money in real estate they are really just regretting that they have lost their ability to milk the financial system and fleece the inexperienced buyer.

that would be great, thanks 56.

Noooo… not Kmart! Have you seen a Kmart latey? The company does not take care of it’s stores. Plus that may drive too much traffic. Lets try to keep the small community charm. Lets have Target instead… ha, ha – just kidding.

If we’re gonna go big chain how about a Banana Republic, Ann Taylor, Bloomingdale’s satelite. I’ve always dreamed of being able to go downstairs if I can’t find something to wear in my closet. This is a wish list, right? :)

enough with the sarcasim. No big chain please.

Big Box stores require loading docks, parking lots and= tons of traffic. Be careful what you wish for! Many apparel chains (such as Banana Republic) can be set up as suburban outpost “shops” – this does not apply to KMart or Target.

again, I am pretty sure that all of the big box store comments were people being sarcastic, 63.

Either way, there is no way that a target or Kmart is moving in because the space is waaaaay too small.

#66 start your own blog then if you want to start topics.

#68, I think you are missing a few costs (especially for land clean-up around here) but let’s say those numbers are close. Also for simplicity’s sake, let’s say that all costs have dropped 23% since 2006. That would leave a 1000 ft 1 bedroom apt priced at half a million dollars. #60, do you think that is an “affordable” price?

#70, yes there is a group:
http://groups.google.com/group/ten63

you have to sign-up at the above link and answer a few questions . You can also use the “contact the owner” link if you have any questions.

We look forward to having you join.

funny, funny … glad to see that you are amusing yourself #70.
although I do appreciate the humor.

#74 While 20% is not a shabby return if you could get it, -20% is what some of these investors will be getting. This is precisely the point no one was forced into doing this so if an investor is going to take such risk voluntarily than they want at least these kinds of returns or else they will invest in less risky options that rewards them accordingly. Therefore, if this is what most investors require as a return than the developer has to make sure that his project has the potential to generate them or else he will not get financing and that abandoned lot/ Brownfield/ warehouse will remain as is, which could be a good thing or bad thing depending how you ask.

75, yes I agree. I think it’s again worth noting that despite all the moaning no NYC area waterfront project has gone under that I am aware of. And for some odd reason investors keep flocking to waterfront development. So I just don’t think we should be readily swayed by the blubbering. It’s frequently little more than a complaint that they are not making as much as quickly as they wished or hoped for. That certainly does not mean that the neighborhood goes to pot without this rampant overheated market. It was in fact slowly growing on its own before things exploded.

#74, you say costs per sq.ft. get lower when building smaller rather than taller. Any basis for this or is this another thing you know nothing about?

78 & 79. I don’t know if you are the same person or two but rudeness and lack of an actual response are common to both replies. If you have nothing of any substance to offer, hiding behind insults and innuendos does not solve much. And whether or not I’m this CUNY person you keep bringing up has no bearing on anything.

I do happen to know something about building costs and development. For starters there are a host of trade offs in terms of the structure and systems needed for high rise as well as zoning requirements. It’s a bell shaped curve. When you factor in the cost of financing versus build out time there are many ways to achieve profitability via faster completion of smaller parcels. This versus having to wait for an entire high rise to be approved and fully built and sold. Put simply bigger is not necessarily always better. And obviously a renovation where possible is way faster and cheaper.

#81, I’ll agree with you that it is conceivable that there are certain instances in which bigger might not be better (in terms of cost of construction) if you’ll agree that most of the time it is better.

Well said, #84. Sorry people are picking on you #81 but your claim that low-density housing should be cheaper seems bogus. Either you have high density and lower prices (due to increased supply and lower cost of construction) or you have low density and higher prices. I’m sure there are instances in which this might not be trus, but in general it is.

So pick one evil to live with — increased density or increased cost of housing.

Maybe this is all moot now with the latest crash anyways — soon we can all live for free in the abandoned buildings.

any idea when Dutch Kills is going to open? in a critical need for a $15 drink.

Ten63 looks pretty nice from the outside. Bad location though. And too bad people who move in will have to look out the window at the Green Monster building and the other white condo that looks like it was built by Ikea across the street.

Is there a google group to talk about how ugly those two buildings are? LOL

:) – It is unfortunate that some Ten63′s view will be of Lhaus. The renderings looked relatively nice, I don’t understand how they went from that to what it’s become…

However, despite the lovely view of Lhaus, Ten63 has a great location. It’s right off of Vernon. on the same block as the subway. and the views from the apartments facing 49th have (currently) unobstructed views of upper Manhattan (even from the lower floors). While it is close to Pulaski it is just after it so you don’t have the traffic right in front of the building. Also, most of the units facing Jackson actually have their living rooms facing the opposite direction (some with balconies) looking at Manhattan (the building has an open inner courtyard on the inside that is open in the back.

49th is a very nice/quiet street and that is where the lobby entrance will be.

All buildings will have their pros and cons but generally speaking I would say that Ten63 has once of the better locations. despite the view of Lhaus.

91, agreed. I am not familiar with the details of building but I do think that it has a great location given it is a quick walk to the waterfront but it also right next to the subway, something key that people fail to mention in LIC. I live on the waterfront and while it is not far, it is a bit of a trek to the subway every day. Aslo, while I hope that it changes, all of the delis, bars and restaurants (the ones worth going to) are on Vernon. Personally the main thing to me is that it actually looks OK and I can’t say the same for many of the other buildings that have been going up.

I mean beyond the developments (hunters, lhaus, 10-63, 10-50, that rental building, echelon, badge) shops are coming in too. Vine wine, creek + cave, sweet leaf, bany, whatever comes to the retail in 10-63 and 10-50, a few useless cell phone stores :) – I also think that Lhaus is pretty ugly but there’s no denying that the area is getting built up in a surprising way and the cool thing is that retail is finally following the development.

96, 93 here, I agree that it is not the most incredible building ever; however, I would say that “Just OK” is a little bit of an understatement. It’s a nice looking building, especially relative to the others in LIC that have been going up recently. But i agree, this should not be the ceiling, hopefully people will try and raise the bar using this as a starting point.

Badge is also OK. I’ll be interested to see what they come up with at the corner of vernon and jackson where that lot that was stalled forever has finally started moving again.

queenswest has some very old renderings but I’m not sure if they are still accurate:
http://www.queenswest.com/maps/condos_coops/5015-vernon-jackson?searchterm=vernon+jackson

#92 is right. Blogs are not courts of law. They are places where we should all be able to make silly statements and pretend like we’re familiar with things we know little about.

I’m actually in charge of a large construction company and we’re planning on taking an old one-story warehouse by the water, cleaning it up and selling 2 and 3 bedroom apartments for less than $100,000 and we’ll still make a huge profit.

yes 99, I’ll buy three, sign me up :)

Or maybe #99 was just making things up.

99, pray tell how exactly you know and for that matter what you know specifically to back up your implication that I am pretending to be “familiar with things I know little about.” It’s a flimsy tactic designed to mask your inability to intelligently ask for clarification. If you don’t understand something you attack it. If you don’t agree with the view you attack the person. It’s a sorry thing that this is all you are capable of doing. But I guess it works for you to push other views out of the picture.

Does anyone know what is going on over by Jackson Avenue? near the citibank building? the small park that is beside sovereign bank. It appears that it’s being made bigger.

I’M NOT SURE AS TO WHY ANYONE WOULD BUY AN APARTMENT IN THIS AREA.

Whether it is apartment or a commercial building it has to be sturdy enough to stand against the rough weathers. Commercial steel buildings are one step ahead to have bird proof buildings.